Shotshell components???

The good news is that I have my eyes and fingers. The bad news is that I those patterns are real bad.

I added and suptracted a little powder and shot. BPI data would be hot and I didnt even load up to that. I dropped the shot count from i think 53 to 49 to get it to fit in the cup better and not over flow and I loaded 4gr longshot under BPI and I think that tamed pressures a bit. Pattern all over, I fired 4 shot at 40 yards on the same target and I think I got 4 or 5 hits on a paper plate!!!!

I need to figure out this roll crimper, im melting the hulls. Less speed and more pressure? I practices on some shot federal hulls I cut and those went fine, the loaded Fiocchi are not going well.
 
I tried to load 3” bb, bbb, 4 buck, t and f with numerous recipes along with purchasing every choke possible and could never get a pattern that i found was acceptable to me. Buffered every load as well. The best option I found was shooting Hornady bb and they weren’t very impressive either. Switched to loading tss and have never looked back. I could have loaded 100’s of rounds of tss for the money and time I wasted. Wish you luck and had a good answer for you. Some guys find the magic load with lead but I never could!! The few opportunities I get to get a coyote within scattergun range I wanna make count. Not saying it’s the answer for everyone but it sure is for me 👍
 
223 said:
I tried to load 3” bb, bbb, 4 buck, t and f with numerous recipes along with purchasing every choke possible and could never get a pattern that i found was acceptable to me. Buffered every load as well. The best option I found was shooting Hornady bb and they weren’t very impressive either. Switched to loading tss and have never looked back. I could have loaded 100’s of rounds of tss for the money and time I wasted. Wish you luck and had a good answer for you. Some guys find the magic load with lead but I never could!! The few opportunities I get to get a coyote within scattergun range I wanna make count. Not saying it’s the answer for everyone but it sure is for me 👍
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Yeah I will get some TSS, thats where I was heading all along and what I would take out for hunting coyotes all the time. Im not letting this rain on my parade, I wanded to play around and see whats what all along anyways. Ive got some BP12 wads I was told was a replacement for BPI 12ga ToughWads, I just cant find any recipes with BP12.

Today I was shooting BPI Original buffer, I have Precision Reloading spherical buffer also, I see that takes up a lot more room. Is a buffer change worth a try?

I used clear plastic overshot cards. I see in a section in the recipe to use OS12 overshot cards.... That couldnt be ruining patterns that bad could it? Im not sure if the other cards i have are OS12 but I have some paper ones also...??? Ok, yes, I see I have OS12 cards also.
 
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I’ve only used the os12 never the plastic. Most of my rounds have been crimped rather than rolled. Rolled work fine in my 870 but my benelli doesn’t care for them.
 
Rock Knocker said:
Ok, ive been there before, I didnt realize that was Hawglips. I see they have #F, #T and 1 buck available now.
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TSS #2 shot is the biggest size of TSS shot I would consider using. For coyotes TSS #4 or #3 shot gives plenty of range and much higher pellet counts.

From KPY Shotshell Ballistics
TSS #3 shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 96.8 yards and has about 100 pellets in 1-1/2 oz of shot.
TSS T shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 217.9 yards and has about 34 pellets in 1-1/2 oz of shot.

For killing coyotes at 80 yards and less 100 pellets per shell will give you more clean kills than a load with only about 34 pellets per shell.

I bought some MG42 wads to make steel shot dove loads and they were the weakest looking steel shot wads I have ever seen.
 
Ive got CSD and BP12 wads also. But I have almost no load data for them. Out of 4 loading manuals I have found 1 recipe for BP12 with some powder I may never find.

Ive got a few more hulls loaded up with MG42 wads, I will test them in my 26" barrel with chokes.

And the biggest problem with the MG42s I got, theyre perforated, I assume they are supposed to tear themselves open. The first one I shot and only one side opened, some others I opened before loading and one side was always much easier to tear open. My last shot I didnt tear open and I never even found the wad. I watch some good videos online of these wads last night!
 
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Tried to make a jig for cut lenths. Free handing works better for me.




I had the shortened BPI tuff wads not open for me using a 100 grains of FG as you can see below. I loaded them with 1 5/8oz shot and original buffer. Guessing not enough powder charge to open them up and i wont be loading them any hotter. These were 2 7/8" cut down and roll crimped 10 gauge loads for my old damascus SxS. Looked like new yet accept for one that a pedal got caught and bent back. Needless to say the patterns were horrible. If i load them with a 1/2" fiber wad and just shot over the top with no buffer they pattern pretty good. The arrows are showing the only marks on the wads. Looks like they just barely contacted barrels on the base. The pedals never contacted the barrels.



I would have to guess your load was underpressured since the pedals didnt open up. Could have been not enough powder charge, your wad/pellets/charge were not packed tightly down, or your roll crimp was not crimped all the way down holding the charge tightly in place.
 
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Rock Knocker said:
Ive got CSD and BP12 wads also. But I have almost no load data for them. Out of 4 loading manuals I have found 1 recipe for BP12 with some powder I may never find.

Ive got a few more hulls loaded up with MG42 wads, I will test them in my 26" barrel with chokes.

And the biggest problem with the MG42s I got, theyre perforated, I assume they are supposed to tear themselves open. The first one I shot and only one side opened, some others I opened before loading and one side was always much easier to tear open. My last shot I didnt tear open and I never even found the wad. I watch some good videos online of these wads last night!
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You are supposed to open them before loading. They are stitched for auto feeding in commerical loading machines. BPI recommends opening all stitched wads before loading.
 
Probably why the pedals did not open...and rotten patterns. After a few hundred dolars spent on testing youll probably find a decent load. Even a crappy load with a pile of small heavy shot im sure will look good on paper. Imo i would not load for 12 gauge just because it can be found on every shelf for sale in some configuraration. Still fun to do if your trying to invent a heavy load. It juat cost more to load for shotguns in todays market than it is to buy loaded ammo it seems.
 
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I opened up most the wads. I shot more today, it didnt matter what I did. Sometimes they opened like they should, sometimes the pedals got tore right off, ether way, hard to even hit a paper plate at 30 yards. I tried them in my 26" with a modified choke, it was a little better.

I want to try these other wads. I need to find how to do it safely.

I am having trouble roll crimping the Fiocchi hulls, I melt them easy, im figuring it out but it would work better if I kept it warm instead of crimping one shell every 30 minutes. I found a recipe for 2 3/4" Federals hulls, they didnt shoot any better. The Federal hulls roll crimp a lot easier and dont melt though. I tried paper and plastic overshot cards, original and spherical buffer.

I made a couple loads with the .310 balls in MG42 and no wad, just a teflon wrap, those did a little better.
 
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I found out that if i cut my hull closer to the overshot cards they crimp easier since there is less hull to push down. Federals roll the best for me. Reminton hulls are a little stiff. Cheddite i have to trim short before roll crimpinf or they end up wrinkling for me because the hulls are thin.
 
I hold them with my fingers as well. Try putting a bunch of Vaseline in your crimper before rolling. Lube is your friend. It might help with not melting hulls.
 
Remember you are shooting a 20" cylinder barrel made for sub 10 yard shots (home defense). Im surprised any of your loads are on paper at 30+yds. Bigger the shot the better, but you would honestly probably be better with a slug.

Your realistic effective range of that gun should be 20 yards. Putting lead shot on target at 30-40yd+ is luck. TSS will do better but still not good.

You could spend more money, use a full length non tox wad, play with cutting your own slits, use buffer, try different slow burning powder recipes, try different shot sizes, or just buy a new barrel with chokes and make anything work.
 
Yep, before wasting any more money on loads and shot I would suggest using your hard earned dollars on a shotgun with a screw in chokes as advised above. I forgot you’re shooting a cylinder bore fixed barrel. Imo just wasting your time trying to develop long distance loads for basically a un choked barrel that’s not meant to shoot it. I use a kicks .670 and .680 mobile in 12 gauge for all my predator loads. I don’t use the cylinder bore for anything except for the one that’s basically built in my 10 gauge Damascus and it sucks for patterns no matter what I load for it. My 20 yard patterns are horrible in it. Anything past 15 yards is a gamble in my gun.
 
Yeah, I wasnt expecting much, I wasnt quite expecting this bad but I came here to learn and Im learning. These MG42 wads wouldnt have been one of my first choices in the first place but thats what I had the most data on.

It has given me a new respect for the 3" Federal 4buck, its just a little flimsy half wad overflowing with shot and it patterns WAY better than my first attempts. I will buy a few more boxes of that stuff to have on hand.

Ive got BP12 wads that I think should pattern better and they hold the same amount as MG42, Ive also got the big CSD wads, I can fit nearly 2oz of #T in there. Those are what I want to be testing but no data, I called BPI and they say they are giving away their Advantages Manual for free and it has BP12 data, hopefully some heavy CSD data also, I was just there on Friday, I wish I knew they were free.
 
I agree with the choked gun of any kind. A cheap 870 will do the trick 👍 Also I load with a lot of mg42 wads and don’t experience much for issues.
 
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