Shotshell components???

Does anyone use the Mica dry wad lube? If it works as advertised, a $9.99 jar might last a lifetime.

Ive got dry HBN lube but I imagine thats even worse to be shooting smoke clouds of around your face. But I did accidently buy a small ammount of large grain size cosmetic grade HBN, then I got the correct very fine grain HBN, its a lifetime supply in one jar...
 
Rock Knocker said:
Does anyone use the Mica dry wad lube? If it works as advertised, a $9.99 jar might last a lifetime.

Ive got dry HBN lube but I imagine thats even worse to be shooting smoke clouds of around your face. But I did accidently buy a small ammount of large grain size cosmetic grade HBN, then I got the correct very fine grain HBN, its a lifetime supply in one jar...
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Its just snake oil. Not worth the 10 bucks, but yes one jar will last a dozen lifetimes. You use about half a teaspoon in a whole bag of wads. It gets EVERYWHERE as you are loading, all over your hand and bench. I fell for it once and never will again. I still have that 1/2 bag of treated wads, i wont use them unless i have to. Stuff is as bad as antisieze
 
Ive made a deal with another member here to buy his single shotshell loading setup, components and some tools. When all of that shows up all I will need is buckshot and TSS.

Thinking about this little 20" shotgun, i will get the barrel drilled for chokes but I was curious about cutting the barrel down. Ive got a 26" BPS already and this one is 20", why not just go down to 18.5" if I am bringing it to a gunsmith? What I was curious about, say i get it drilled and tapped for Invector Plus chokes with the threads on the bottom. Could I have the 20" barrel drilled and tapped for chokes AND THEN cut 1" or 1.5" inches off the muzzle, leaving the Invector threads. I could then cut a couple factory chokes in half for a 18.5 or 19" barrel plus still be able to thread in full length factory chokes to get 20". Is that a feasible idea or are the exposed factory chokes going to cause problems, not having enough support for the barrel??? I would rather leave it 20" than cause problems but if I could swap chokes to gain or lose and inch, that might be nice.
 
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Depends on how much of the choke forcing cone you are cutting off to shorten/thread the barrel. Generally this would not improve patterns. But shooting TSS and hand loaded shells??? Especially under 50 yards, may not matter.
 
spotstalkshoot said:
Depends on how much of the choke forcing cone you are cutting off to shorten/thread the barrel. Generally this would not improve patterns. But shooting TSS and hand loaded shells??? Especially under 50 yards, may not matter.
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What I was thinking, with the cut barrel and choke idea, I would probably cut a factory cylinder choke flush for 18.5", that way I would have a 18.5" cylinder barrel for no reason other than just being short. If I wanted to hunt coyotes and shoot for tight groups I could thread in a full length factory modified or full choke, that would get me back to 20" and simply be the factory choke exposed 1.5" out of the cut 18.5" barrel. If that makes sense... or is possible....

I just measured an Invector plus choke. If I cut 1.5 inches off the front to fit a 18.5" barrel flush, that would bring me right to the top of the Invector Plus choke's threads. So I could cut 1.5" off of the factory chokes and still have the full thread surface for install. I would just be missing the 1.5 inches of barrel supporting the full length chokes if I installed them for 20"....... Sounds like a hastle, but I cant see why it wouldnt work.
 
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I've loaded for 28ga, 20ga, 16ga and 12ga for a long time, hunting loads only. Also load for a number of handgun loads for a long time and something I figured out is I don't experiment with loads much at all, powder's are to fast for me to fool with so I only load for loads I have data for. Found with the shotgun's there's simply not much around other than published stuff, same with handguns. With rifles I swap bullet's, powders and primers and case's with no worry's.
 
Polock said:
I've loaded for 28ga, 20ga, 16ga and 12ga for a long time, hunting loads only. Also load for a number of handgun loads for a long time and something I figured out is I don't experiment with loads much at all, powder's are to fast for me to fool with so I only load for loads I have data for. Found with the shotgun's there's simply not much around other than published stuff, same with handguns. With rifles I swap bullet's, powders and primers and case's with no worry's.
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I think you're the third person to say this. Good to know, I WILL NOT get too experimental. I wouldnt mind messing around with some wads to look for different results but I will keep the powder loads on the lower side.
 
Rock Knocker said:
What I was thinking, with the cut barrel and choke idea, I would probably cut a factory cylinder choke flush for 18.5", that way I would have a 18.5" cylinder barrel for no reason other than just being short. If I wanted to hunt coyotes and shoot for tight groups I could thread in a full length factory modified or full choke, that would get me back to 20" and simply be the factory choke exposed 1.5" out of the cut 18.5" barrel. If that makes sense... or is possible....

I just measured an Invector plus choke. If I cut 1.5 inches off the front to fit a 18.5" barrel flush, that would bring me right to the top of the Invector Plus choke's threads. So I could cut 1.5" off of the factory chokes and still have the full thread surface for install. I would just be missing the 1.5 inches of barrel supporting the full length chokes if I installed them for 20"....... Sounds like a hastle, but I cant see why it wouldnt work.
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The choking is done after the threads. All youll be doing is wasting money and a barrel. Extending a choke out like that is going to blow your choke right out the end of the barrel. Theres a reason we all probably shoot extended chokes these days, longer choking section the better... But the majority of the choke needs to be in the barrel for pressure reasons. You are trying to make an invector choke which was a tiny little short choke (not the same threads as plus), they sucked and rarely threw good patterns with anything. My guns with invector need a full constriction size or more to get equivalent patterns as my inv plus, rem, and mobil chokes.


You probably won't get invector plus chokes, rarely can they do that in a barrel that wasnt already choked that is being shortened. Youll probably end up with tru choke system, hopefully not thin wall because then you cant shoot any nontox. Plus the taps for inv+ are very expensive, not much chance a local gunsmith has one. They are probably going to send your barrel to briley to be done anyways.
 
Ok, that was my main concern, if the full length factory chokes would have a problem without the rest of the barrel. I will just leave it with 20".

Is there any way I could measure what barrel I have now to see what chokes are possible? This 20" cylinder barrel is .065" thick at the muzzle. I guess I never thought about not being able to find a tap for Invector plus, I suppose different chokes arent that big of a deal but I would love to use my other Invector Plus chokes.
 
spotstalkshoot said:
You can probably pickup a new Black Aces 18.5 pump with tubes and rail mount/open sights for 200.00 or a bull pup for 400.00 with tubes.
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Wow, those bullpups look kind of cool. I havent seen those before, how are they selling them for $400?

I wont be getting anymore shotguns soon, if I do it will be a side by side muzzleloader. One of these short BPSs has been very high on my list of guns to find, for some reason i just like these pump guns, this was like other shotgunners getting a Benelli M4. But I dont love the plain cylinder with a bead barrel. Im going to need chokes, I kind of want to keep it 20" for hunting, I kind of want to cut it as short as legal, and I want to figure out a better aiming solution. Long term I will probably install a RMR but I would also like to see what other options I have for front sights and something like a rear ghost ring. I want to be able to adjust point of impact some but not ruin the gun for something like grouse hunting.

Im going to need to get a hold of a gunsmith, or two. Nothing aftermarket is advertise for these BPSs so I need to find out what can be made to work.
 
If it was already metnioned my apologies.

Lyman just released their latest 6th edition shotshell reloading handbook last week. That would be the one I'd recommend to start with.
 
Id tell you to look at plain old chilled magnum lead shot in size BB on up. It will keep costs down. I roll crimp my 10 guage rounds with a BPI 4 pin roll crimper. I had to horse trade for hulls and wads. Some were given to me. If it were me if just buy over the counter ammo for 12 gauge. I own the old school Lee loaders in both 10 guage sizes and 3" 12 gauge. I have a mec 10 gauge loadee and 12 guage lee load all...that i dont use. Dont load enough and dont fold crimp. I mainly load 10 gauge black powder loads for my damascus SxS and 3.5" 2.5 oz #5 turkey loads. Tried 3oz but the pattern falls apart after 25 yards. The 2.5 oz loads i can put 110 lead #5's evenly in a 10" circle at 55 yards. Expermented with pedal count and length on BPI tuff wads. Four cuts to the 4th ring down along with a pattermaster code black turkey choke has done the best for me with #5 lead 2.5 oz loads. I havent loaded any 12 gauge yet. Just because i have tons of facotory ammo for them. I also dont have any wads for 12 either.





Above is my last loading of 2.5 oz #5's. I used an old school 3.5" lee loader and a craftsman unversal drill press to roll crimp. I have the vintage lee loaders in 2 7/8" 10 and 3" 12 guage. I do have a lee load all 12 gauge and mec 10 gauge loader that ive necer used because i dont fold crimp my shells. You can get by with a bastic set up. Learning chips from the dollar store. Roll crimped with a 4 pin roller. Made the blocks myself. Imo the only reason to load is to get better patterns and heavier payloads...and mainly for obsolite calibers and loads like my 2 7/8" black powder turkey loads for my damascus 1873' charles daly SxS 10 gauge. Also started reloading modern 10 gauge Federal started roll crimping their grand slams and dont trim the hulls before doing so. The wont load of cycle in my Browning gold 10. So i either would have to order winchester turkey ammo when its availble. No thanks. Need some more 10 guage hulls if anyone has some to spare.
 
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Ive been looking into the Federal Flight Control wads a bit. Some people are cutting other wads to have the little wings that fold back from the rear of the cup instead of the front, I havent heard many good results with that except one video of a guy cutting 16ga CDS wads and loading them with 4buck and he nailed it, his replica of flight control wads even punched clean holes through the paper at 35 or 40 yards with great patterns.

I see that Federals wads have a large cut cup area that the powder fits inside then blows the flaps forward to simulate something like a badminton petcock and create drag from the rear.

The best way I was thinking about reproducing this would be to sand the bottom of two wads nice and flat at the bottom and glue them together so you have a shotcup facing up and down, cut the top and bottom cup just like Federal. Is that safe experimenting or too "out-there"?

Do mylar wraps inside a wad help at all with controlling patterns?
 
You won’t find any load data for that, and you won’t find any for factory flight control wads either. That’s a rabbit hole that isn’t worth pursuing in my opinion. You have been given lots of options that have published data available. Shotgun loads aren’t the place for experiments. Your new wad COULD change pressures enough to put you 20% over max, because with a shotgun 2500 PSI is all it takes to get there.
 
Jorhal gives good advise. When i was experimenting with pedal slit cuts. The shallowest 4 pedal cut caused a pressure spike. Blew the primer, felt recoil was a night and day harder kick, and my pattern hit a foot higher at 55 yards vs the 2 and 4 pedal deeper cuts with the exact same wad and powder charge.

Flight control wads are unfortunately only offered in loaded ammo. Went down that rabbit hole years ago. Appartently people who worked for federal years ago got their hands on some. Lucky!!!
 
I just agreed to buy a pile of shotgun loading manuals in the classifieds section, that will give me some good reading.

Im going to have to look for pressure and warning signs even if loading only to the manual. I know myself well enough, this kind of loading has me interested, Ive loaded plenty of Fclass and other ammo but I cant do anything beside ladder test, this is different.

This reminds me of around 25 years ago a teenage kid with a potato gun at my parents apple tree. I discovered one day that a 2oz Dixie cup made a perfect gas seal for a 2" PVC pipe. I didnt know what a gas seal was but i could see the possibilities and I made my potato guns to unthread the barrel and load into the bottom. I found I could then wrap a golf ball tight with paper towel and stick that into the bottom of the barrel with the dixie cup gas seal behind it, boy oh boy. I went to show my dad, he was plenty used to seeing me shoot apples 200 yards into the farm field across the street. Well, I aimed the golf ball into the air and they would travel out of sight in a straight line, they would shoot straigh over the whole field over the woods behind it, over the house behind the woods and into the farm field somewhere out of sight. My dad was shocked, he wouldnt let me do that any more, I dont think my mom even bought Dixie cups after that...
 
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