NEW Shotgun Pattern Test Results - Detail & Pic' heavy...

WPH,
You have picked some winners from the Big Three manufacturers. I would choose to begin my load testing with a quality extended choke of about .680" for the overbore Mossberg and the 3 ½” shell. The work there is yours to do, if you really want the ultimate load and choke, you have to assemble all the offerings and go to the range. Choose the one that patterns the best for you. You might throw another choke diameter in there if you want and see if the .680” is the sweet spot for your loads and barrel. It is a lot of work and more than a little expense, but experimenting on the range with pattern paper is the only way to know for sure what actually the ultimate is for you. I ended up using three choke diameters with all the shells in my experiment to find the best of the best for me and my guns.
 
Thank you for the info I am most interested in trying the Federal and Winchester waterfowl loadings that I listed. Are you familiar with the shot shape that Federal uses. Do you think that it could be good at extended ranges. I would really like to know the velocity of the Winchester load. Lastly both of these loads are 1.625 oz of BB+ and B. Is this a heavy enough charge and a large enough pellet for long range.

I know that I have to put in some range time and try some different things but the potential has to be there initially to build the ultimate long range rig. I do not have a lot of experience so I am trying to get all of the info I can before I start.

It looks like I may be trying some different things so I will try to post results.

I hope I can get feedback soon so I can order stuff tomorrow.
 
This Federal load you refer to isn't a steel shot load is it? Black Cloud? Don't waste time on steel shot for long range coyotes. Steel lacks penetration on geese, let alone a critter as tough as a coyote and that weighs four times more! The .12 gauge 3” load of HD-BB’s I shoot only has 1 ½ ounces of shot at 1,300 fps and it is a solid killer to at least the 50 yard line. It does that with BB size shot because of the dense heavier than lead weight of the HD shot, the hardness without being too brittle, and the decent velocity of 1,300 fps. I discounted the Winchester loading when I did my testing because the largest shot was B and the shot charge was light. Velocity is good, but the pellets were smaller than I prefer and just not enough of them. Winchester sacrificed pellet count for velocity. That can work if it all plays out just so, but I really didn’t want to drop below the BB size shot.
 
Thanks to everyone for all the hard work and posting all this great information. I have a Mossberg 935 and a Kicks GT .690 choke. I am going to give the Rem HD BB's a try. My question is should I try 3" or 3.5"? I have had better luck with 3.5" turkey loads.
 
Matt,
Up to you buddy... Your gun and choke will take the 3.5" shell just fine. You might try both to see which patterns best from your rig and then go from there.
 
GC,

I ordered the Federal High Density waterfowl loads in 3.5 inch BB+ 100 pellets at 1450fps. After I got the shells I realized they were not what I thought they were. If you have a federal catalog or study their website you will see what I am talking about. This load is a steel replacement being softer and denser than steel but is about the same density as lead, slightly less, 10g/cc. I misundersood the catalog, their high density is actually not high density, their heavyweight is high density. Should I sideline this load?

In the Remington Wingmaster HD which pellet size do you recommend BB or T? Also, what is a good choke size to start with in a Mossberg 835 for either load? And, do you know the pellet count in 3.5 inch of their BB and T?

What do you think of a 00 Buckshot load of 15-18 pellets out to "extended" ranges? Is there potential? What would be a good starting point for a choke size in a Mossberg 835 and 00 ?

Sorry if I am bugging you, there just is not anywhere else that I know of for good info. I have an old stand by combo of 4 buck in the Mossberg 500 but I am trying to upgrade. I know that I need to field test but I need good starting points. Thanks a lot.
 
Last edited:
WPH,
Let me see if I can answer you by the line... Whether you sideline the load or send it back for a refund is up to you. Personally, I'd get a refund.

I choose the BB's because they patterned better for me from my chokes. I really wanted the T's to work out, but that wasn't to be for me. Because of the special characteristics of the HD shot I am satisfied with the BB size shot. HD carries more energy than lead and with the harder alloy penetrates better. It is sort of like taking a step or maybe even two sizes up in size over plated lead pellets. T's might be better for really long ranges if they pattern well for you.

For choke constrictions I'd look first at something around .680" - .685" for your Mossberg with 3 ½” loads.

Skip the 00 Buck... do some research reading here. 00 Buck offers nothing to a predator caller and in fact has several distinct disadvantages. Namely the too few pellets and thin sparse patterns. 00 is also considerably harder to get good long distance patterns with than smaller sizes like No. Four Buck and down.
 
Great thread. I was at the range today and my friend gave me a couple rounds of dead coyote 12 gauge 3.5 inch T. I have a benelli nova with patternmaster extended range. I have never come across a load that I would use at 50 yards but this did it. I shot at a piece of 8.5 x 11 inch computer paper. 27 pellets on the paper. We figured 9 would hit a fox if it was facing you for a head on head/chest shot like we usually get at night when lighting up eyes. Thats impressive. One thing thats interesting is 3.5 shells general pattern looser than 3 inch out of a pattermaster extended range choke. I just ordered a box of remington HD wingmaster 3 inch BB. I'll be curious to see how it performs. I'll take pics next time. Never used these non toxic alternative before but if the BB performs well I'll be picking up some turkey loads too. Too bad its so expensive. I would need a second job to use it for waterfowl.
 
I'm going to try some of the HD turkey loads too. I see Big Green has a rebate on turkey loads so that will ease the pain some.
 
I have an older Beretta A390 and have been using Carlson's dead Coyote choke tube with 1 7/8" copper plated BB shot. I havent been impressed with the patterning but have shot 2 coyotes with the combo. Both dropped where they stood at 50 and 60 yards. Is there a better choice of choke tube constriction I can try improve my patterns at long range? I just picked up a Primos Dead dog and havent given it a try yet along with a mad max turkey choke. I have tried 2 of the original pattern masters out of my 10 gauge Browning in the past and have had better patterning out of my factory chokes and the best being a discontinued Herters extended range tube that I picked up from Cabelas bargin bin for eight bucks. Pattern master replaced the old ones with an extended tube but I havent had a chance to try it and after the less than stellar perfomance I dont feel opt to purchase a $100 paper weight again. I have been reading that around .680 is the best overall? Is this good for my diameter barrel and if so who also makes that diameter to try? Eventualy I am going to step up to the plate and pull the trigger once the New Benelli is unvailed, providing its 3.5" and camoed. For some reason most of the 3.5" patterns I have seen seem to have blown patterns at longer ranges versus the 3" ammo offerings...just me or have manufactures been improving ammunition and choke tubes yet. It just seems like the 3.5" shells have been a gimmic so far but of course I am drawn to make a purchase anyways.
 
Dultixxx,
For BB's and T-shot you might look at something around .670" as a good beginning ground. You just don't absolutely know how it'll do until you shoot them with several loads on paper at various ranges. I have a .655 JellyHead, .660" Kick's GT, .665" Indian Creek Black Diamond Strike, .670" Kick's GT, and a .680" Kick's GT for my older Benelli M1S90's. The Indian Creek choke is new and I'll be shooting it some very soon. Right now the .660" and .670" Kick's are my most used chokes. The Indian Creek is an unknown and I am anxious to do some shooting with it. On a side note, for 00 Buck the factory Benelli Improved Modified has out patterned anything else I have found to date.
 
The bore diameter of that Mossberg 835 is a nominal .775, and a constricition of .045 is X-full. A .680 choke tube would be .095 constricion. I do belive that a .680 choke tube on a Mossberg 835 would be a little too tight?
 
I have a benelli M-2---the best Choke for remington HD BB was the trulock .685 choke tube--this patterned very well out to 40 yards---my self imposed limit.
I have found that when velocities exceed 1300 fps or payload exceeds 1 5/8 oz. paterns tend to blow apart.
I have also found that hand loaded ammo works better than factory--if I shoot factory ammo it is Rem HD
The above is just my opinion and results from my guns and loads.
 
Quote:
The bore diameter of that Mossberg 835 is a nominal .775, and a constricition of .045 is X-full. A .680 choke tube would be .095 constricion. I do belive that a .680 choke tube on a Mossberg 835 would be a little too tight?



Rich has a point, the M835 is a .12 gauge with a .10 gauge bore. Good catch Rich! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif
 
Im trying to setup a Benelli M1 with a 21 inch barrel. I plan to shoot 3 inch Dead Coyote, Remington HD BB, or Federal Premium #4 buck. I intend to limit my shotgun shots to around 35 yards and mostly use it for hard running chargers so 10 yard shots maybe common. With that said I'm not looking for a choke that shoots real real tight for 40+ yard shots. But I want to make sure I can knock one dead at 35 yards if one stops and hangs up while I'm committed to my shotgun. Does anybody have suggestions on what chokes and size I should think about?
 
I'll bet your factory Improved Modified choke will do very well for that application. Improved Modified constriction is in the middle between the standard Modified and Full chokes. My Benelli factory IM choke is excellent with all shot sizes up to and including 00 Buck and is one of my most used chokes for other game I use my shotguns on. In fact, my Tactical Model M1 has the IM choke in it and is stuffed with Federal Premium 00 Buck for serious predator encounters of the two legged kind. That gun will give me 30 yard patterns I can rely on to keep all 9 of the 00 Buck pellets within a man size target. I can swap out the 00 Buck for a slug and it hits right on at 60 yards and groups well enough for my needs and purposes for this gun. If I expected 35 yards to be tops and needed a pattern big enough for hard chargers at ultra close range that would be the first choke I would look to. BTW, I'm jealous of that 21" vent ribbed screw-in choke Benelli M1 barrel. I'd like to run across one with a reasonable price on it.
 
I just checked on the Remington Web-site and they have a rebate for $15.00 back on the Rem HD BB loads in 3" and 3.5" they also show a rebate for the 3.5" Predator "T" shot load. The 3" Predator HD "T" shot load is not on the rebate list. This rebate is for only up to $15.00. There are a bunch of Turkey loads on the rebate list also. The rebate offer is good through 4/30/09.
 
Back
Top