Stun guns for snake bites.
- Thread starter Okiedog
- Start date
doorgunner
New member
I too was curious when I first heard of this method being used as first aid for snakebites down here in South Texas. I watched a documentary about a year ago on snakebites on the Discovery Channel (I think). The issue of stun guns was brought up, and some ER Physician who was a snakebite guru said that it had absolutely no effect on the toxins from pit vipers. So there ya go, just when I was about to order a three gazillion volt stungun (more is better, right?), my hopes were dashed. Surely there is a doctor lurking around here on this board somewhere, who can research and answer this for us.
Michael J. McCasland
New member
Hmmm, interesting question and I have nothing new to offer to the debate. This would be a tough one to prove either way. It would be difficult to find enough people that would volunteer to be snake bit for a double blind test. Well I guess a double blind test would be hard, you can't exactly fake getting hit with electricity now can you. At least not in America ....... now if you could hook a "God", electricity, snake bite and 20 virgins aspect into Islam you might get more volunteers than can be handled. Wait a minute if you could hook a 20 virgin aspect into about anything you might get more responce than can be handled...................... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
NASA
New member
Electricty does not detoxify snake venom. Easy to prove, too. Catch a diamondback and milk it into a glass. Hit the venom with a 35K volt stun gun. Now, draw the venom into a syringe and inject it into your neighbors cat. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif You will have accomplished two things, and one of them is getting rid of a damn cat!
Rich Cronk
New member
The "shock the bite" idea was once believed to cause muscles to contract or something like that. Anyway the theory was that if you shocked the bite area with spark plug wire or stun gun, the venom would be slower to circulate through your body. The "experts" now advise to simply remain calm as possible, and get to emergency room right away. Forget about shocking yourself.
BroncoGlenn
New member
I'm gonna go with Rich on this. There's been so many "methods" to treat a snake bite out there, and most all of them cause more problems than the snake bite itself causes.
Best thing to do is remain calm. Shoot the friggin snake and find a doctor. Shooting the snake serves three purposes: First, it establishes positive ID of the snake so when Bubba thinks you are full of it and that you never got bit by a coon tail and it musta been a garter snake you can show him the snake. Second, it'll make you feel better. Third, the snake skin will make a dandy hat band, belt, wallet, or boots depending on the size of the snake.
Best thing to do is remain calm. Shoot the friggin snake and find a doctor. Shooting the snake serves three purposes: First, it establishes positive ID of the snake so when Bubba thinks you are full of it and that you never got bit by a coon tail and it musta been a garter snake you can show him the snake. Second, it'll make you feel better. Third, the snake skin will make a dandy hat band, belt, wallet, or boots depending on the size of the snake.
Rich Cronk
New member
BroncoGlenn,
Right on Bronco! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif They even would like a feller to bring the snake to emergency room with you so that they can determine for sure which anti-venom to give ya. Some of those texas diamondbacks weigh as much as eight pounds though. Holy Mackeral! The nurses at ER would all have a heart attack if a feller brought one of those in to the ER.
Right on Bronco! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif They even would like a feller to bring the snake to emergency room with you so that they can determine for sure which anti-venom to give ya. Some of those texas diamondbacks weigh as much as eight pounds though. Holy Mackeral! The nurses at ER would all have a heart attack if a feller brought one of those in to the ER.
My trauma book.....
"A review of the literature indicates that authorities do not agree on first aid techniques. The main objective is to calm the victim and provide transport as quickly as possible to a physician. Pitts has stated that the best first aid item is a set of car keys"
Also says some people have been bitten more than once in attempting to kill the snake (good idea for positive ID) so be careful.
If the hospital is out of anti venom and everyone is freaking out kindly ask them to call the zoo, they stock up on the stuff. I remember a story from scool concerning a guy who kept poisonous snakes for pets and some foreign snake bit him and the hospital didn't know what to do because they didn't carry the anti venom....the zoo had piles of it.
You guys don't want to know what the surgeon is going to do to get all that venom and dead tissue cleaned up.....if I told you you can forget the 'remain calm' stuff.
"A review of the literature indicates that authorities do not agree on first aid techniques. The main objective is to calm the victim and provide transport as quickly as possible to a physician. Pitts has stated that the best first aid item is a set of car keys"
Also says some people have been bitten more than once in attempting to kill the snake (good idea for positive ID) so be careful.
If the hospital is out of anti venom and everyone is freaking out kindly ask them to call the zoo, they stock up on the stuff. I remember a story from scool concerning a guy who kept poisonous snakes for pets and some foreign snake bit him and the hospital didn't know what to do because they didn't carry the anti venom....the zoo had piles of it.
You guys don't want to know what the surgeon is going to do to get all that venom and dead tissue cleaned up.....if I told you you can forget the 'remain calm' stuff.
Hey Okiedog
Stun guns, naw, not a good idea. I'm a Paramedic in West Tx and we get about 4 to 6 rattle bites a year. The current from the gun does contract the muscle, however to enable the muscle to contract the body releases bunch of chemicles. The only way to get them there fast is through blood flow and nerve endings. As long as the muscle stays contracted, it needs increased blood flow for oxygen. Eventually the muscle tires from a lack of oxygen and has to relax. This is why we can't keep our muscles contracted for long periods of time. Bottom line, increased blood flow to the envenomated (bite) area the faster the venom will spread. Best advise for snake bites is to relax, get medical attention ASAP. Check out this site for further.
http://www.angelfire.com/biz/SnakeDenSpecialties/PrRat.html
Stun guns, naw, not a good idea. I'm a Paramedic in West Tx and we get about 4 to 6 rattle bites a year. The current from the gun does contract the muscle, however to enable the muscle to contract the body releases bunch of chemicles. The only way to get them there fast is through blood flow and nerve endings. As long as the muscle stays contracted, it needs increased blood flow for oxygen. Eventually the muscle tires from a lack of oxygen and has to relax. This is why we can't keep our muscles contracted for long periods of time. Bottom line, increased blood flow to the envenomated (bite) area the faster the venom will spread. Best advise for snake bites is to relax, get medical attention ASAP. Check out this site for further.
http://www.angelfire.com/biz/SnakeDenSpecialties/PrRat.html
coyotebuster
New member
I like your thinking. I kill every snake that slithers on our property, just because I hate them and they must die!
WolverineAtWork
New member
I was thinking about it, and you guys just know that this whole theory got started when someone got bit and his buddy, sick of listening and watching him freak out, hit him w/ a couple thousand volts. Presto, made things better, he just picks up his (now involutarily calm) friend, and rushes him to the ER.
I think it was just one of those "would'ja shuttup about the damn snake bite!!!" ZZZZZZAPPPP... "Ahhh.. better."
I think it was just one of those "would'ja shuttup about the damn snake bite!!!" ZZZZZZAPPPP... "Ahhh.. better."
SavTxCajun
New member
I got bit by a water mocoson a few years ago.
While cutting the front yard grass I put my hand under the carrage to help lift the wheels higher. Zap right on the index finger. S^&%, I got a hammer and killed the snake, finished mowing the grass and then I put the snake into a ziplock and went to the hospital about 11/2 miles away during evening traffic. Slapped the bag with the snake down at the entrance and said I want to see a doctor. That gets attention fast.
They keep me under observasion for 2 hours with a cold pack on my hand.
Lost 2 days of work because I couldn't type on a computer with a basketball at the end of my wrist.
It took along tiime for the meat to return to that finger. Be carefull. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
While cutting the front yard grass I put my hand under the carrage to help lift the wheels higher. Zap right on the index finger. S^&%, I got a hammer and killed the snake, finished mowing the grass and then I put the snake into a ziplock and went to the hospital about 11/2 miles away during evening traffic. Slapped the bag with the snake down at the entrance and said I want to see a doctor. That gets attention fast.
They keep me under observasion for 2 hours with a cold pack on my hand.
Lost 2 days of work because I couldn't type on a computer with a basketball at the end of my wrist.
It took along tiime for the meat to return to that finger. Be carefull. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Richard Grantham
New member
Just had to add my one cent ( used to be two cent)
Thing on Tv on snake bite told the darndest, two drunks playing with pet snake, one got bit, heard the fable of electric shock got jumper cables out attached to bit guy- the buddy got in car to rev up motor, passed out and caused damage to lip area from current- oh yeh the bit guy was trying to kiss pet snake!
When I live in Arizona they used to urge packing ice around area to slow circulation, now out of style as you can cause tissue damage. Talked to a Mexican one time that proudly showed missing finger tip, he had cut it off after getting bit!!
Richard Grantham
Thing on Tv on snake bite told the darndest, two drunks playing with pet snake, one got bit, heard the fable of electric shock got jumper cables out attached to bit guy- the buddy got in car to rev up motor, passed out and caused damage to lip area from current- oh yeh the bit guy was trying to kiss pet snake!
When I live in Arizona they used to urge packing ice around area to slow circulation, now out of style as you can cause tissue damage. Talked to a Mexican one time that proudly showed missing finger tip, he had cut it off after getting bit!!
Richard Grantham
More people lose fingers and toes then lose lives from rattlesnakes, copperheads and water moccasins, reason is they are hemo toxin. We have one snake that is nero toxin, the coral snake, but it's very rare they bite someone. Aww...but we also have a snake that has both venims. This snake lives in the southwest desert, if it bites you it's attacking your blood and your nervous system. It's the only snake in the world that can do that. Does anyone know it's common name?
Robert Cobb
New member
The Mojave Rattler, Danny... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
NASA
New member
Mojave toxin is one of the most lethal venom components found in US snakes. Venom B populations are less lethal than venom A populations.
Venom A populations of Mojave rattlesnakes possess Mojave toxin, which has been experimentally shown to induce neurotoxic effects. Mojave toxin or a similar toxin has been detected in the venom of other rattlesnakes, such as some Crotalus viridis subspecies. This toxin impairs presynaptic acetylcholine release. Mojave toxin may cause severe neurologic effects clinically, although this presentation is not encountered often and has been reported only a few times in the literature. Envenomation by several other species of rattlesnakes has been reported to cause serious neurological signs and symptoms (eg, severe motor weakness, respiratory paralysis).
Venom A Mojave rattlesnakes cause less local injury and less hemorrhagic/proteolytic effects than other rattlesnakes. In contrast, venom B specimens cause local, proteolytic, and hemorrhagic effects typical of other rattlesnakes. Severe rhabdomyolysis with myoglobinuric renal failure has been reported with Mojave rattlesnake envenomation.
So there!
Venom A populations of Mojave rattlesnakes possess Mojave toxin, which has been experimentally shown to induce neurotoxic effects. Mojave toxin or a similar toxin has been detected in the venom of other rattlesnakes, such as some Crotalus viridis subspecies. This toxin impairs presynaptic acetylcholine release. Mojave toxin may cause severe neurologic effects clinically, although this presentation is not encountered often and has been reported only a few times in the literature. Envenomation by several other species of rattlesnakes has been reported to cause serious neurological signs and symptoms (eg, severe motor weakness, respiratory paralysis).
Venom A Mojave rattlesnakes cause less local injury and less hemorrhagic/proteolytic effects than other rattlesnakes. In contrast, venom B specimens cause local, proteolytic, and hemorrhagic effects typical of other rattlesnakes. Severe rhabdomyolysis with myoglobinuric renal failure has been reported with Mojave rattlesnake envenomation.
So there!
BroncoGlenn
New member
AKA the mojave green. Nasty buggers. And mean too! Had one trying to strike the tires on a jeep just because it was parked on trail in the snakes path.