M-1 Garand, 458 Win Mag

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Bofire

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I ordered a new Tikka Varmit 22-250, switched some scopes around putting a Leupold 4.5X14 on the new Tikka when it gets here.
Put a 3X9 Leupy on the 243 and went to the range to sight it in.

This guy had two M-1 Garands Beautiful guns, in, I aint lieing!

458 Win Mag, we shot it a few times, not too bad, a BIG push.

Too cool huh? what a bear gun!! or Rock Chucks! LOL
Carl
 
What kind of pressure does a 458 work with? An M1 Garand does not have a very strong action, they can't even take the pressure of many factory 30-06 rounds. Besides, who would make a barrel for one? Garand barrels are not that easy to make.
 
I talked to a very good gunsmith and was told the action as you said would not take the pressure at all and the barrel very hard to make and then the gun would not at all be safe to shoot The barrels on the Grand are to thin to rebore to a 45 cal. I think there is a little BS here Mauser
 
There is a guy who specializes in reworking Garands into all sorts of calibers, including the big standard length magnums. There was a write up in one of the gun magazines a couple of years back. It ain't BS, but it is real expensive.
I thought about getting my Garand redone to a more interesting caliber but couldn't see any good reason to spend $2500 on an old Garand.
As I remember the gunsmith has a website about his work. Like I said, it has been several years so I am a bit hazy on the details but the magazine article tested one of the reworked rifles in 338 Winchester Magnum.
 
Well Mauser you think what you want, before I made a statement like that I'd look you in the eye. I take slams on my character very seriously.

I was there I saw it I shot it, both of them.
Jack I do not know what type the action was, they looked like M-1's to me but I do not know much about them. One a long un-blued with synthetic stock, one shorter with laminated.
They hold three rounds in the magazine.I saw about 30 rounds go thru them without a hitch.
Michael, my Speer book shows 53,000 lbs. for the 458 as max. pressure, 50,000lbs, for the 06. I do not know who made the barrel. The guy "Rich" was a short stocky red head.
He said he built them both. He also stated that he had others in 35. caliber. This was at the Tacoma Sportsmans Club.
I sure hope to meet you in person one day Mauser.

Carl
 
Never heard of a Garand action being worked over this way. I have heard of Browning BAR's being rebarreled, or rebored, and chambered for the .458 Winchester. That's not such a stretch since the BAR is routinely factory chambered for the .300 and .338 Winchester Magnums. Doesn't the AR-15 series of rifles have a wildcat .458 SOCOM chambering for them? But a Garand, that's something else again, wow!
 
There are some mighty odd things out there. My dad, well if my step mother would give it up it would be mine, had an M1 carbine built to tke a 44 Auto mag. Talk about a gun that will crack a stock and beat you up. The barrel is almost shotgun thin. I know he spent alot of money to get a gun that is little different from a 44mag. So, I guess a 458 on an M1 garand action is not entirely impossible. ... but why?
 
It was probably a Mini 14, and it probably was chambered in 458 SOCOM, which is a sort of short version of the 458 Win Mag. A company called Tromix used to custom build them.


-Dave
 
Quote:
An M1 Garand does not have a very strong action, they can't even take the pressure of many factory 30-06 rounds.




????Never heard that one before. Might bend an op rod or something but I don't think you will get chamber failure. I shoot modern hunting ammo in my Garand frequently as do many others.
 
JasonV - If you are shooting factory ammunition, you are looking for battering issues with your Garand. Sure the barrel won't fail, but you will eventually beat up your action. This information is available almost everywhere the Garand is mentioned.

davestarbuck - I sure hope you weren't refering to my post about the M1 carbine with the 45 win mag conversion. If you were trust me on this one. Dad, a gun dealer in upstate New York at the time, found a darned near new (mechanicly) M1 Carbine and had the conversion done to it. He read about doing it in a magazine somewhere. The guy advertised it to be equal to the 45-70. Dad called the guy and had the conversion done. The whole thing seemed kind of stupid to me at the time, but he sure had fun with it. THere is absolutely no question about it this was an M1 carbine, I'm pretty sure it is on a Winchester action.
 
Quote:
JasonV - If you are shooting factory ammunition, you are looking for battering issues with your Garand. Sure the barrel won't fail, but you will eventually beat up your action. This information is available almost everywhere the Garand is mentioned.




There is a wealth of information about hunting with a Garand and not using fmj ball ammunition. I guess we just frequent different forums, read different books, and will have to agree to disagree.
 
This is not a FMJ vs hunting style bullet issue. M2 ball ammunition was loaded down to ~2700fps with a 150 gr bullet because 172gr mahine gun ammunition was destroying garand actions. This is not a myth or an attempt to run down the Garand, I like my Garand very much and shot it alot for a while. I even ran CMP Garand qualifying matches here in Tucson for a few years. I've loaded many thousand rounds for my Garand. Please, if you like your Garand don't shoot full powered factory loads through it.
 
interesting

I do agree that ANY rifle can be harmed by over pressure conditions with the wrong ammo.

Even Fulton Armory advocates use of commercial hunting ammo in a M1 Garand. They reccomend and sell Black Hills Gold 165 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip for hunting and 168 and 175 grain Black Hills Match for accuracy.

To each his own:)
 
JasonV - I did a little search and fairly quickly came up witha lengthy article on care and feeding of the Garand. I cut this out of it for your consideration:

So you usually can’t go wrong with Mil-Surp as long as you know what you’re buying. It’s cheap, available, safe in your Garand & good for general shooting. Although I must stress that Mil-Surp ammo is not to be used for most hunting. The projectiles are non-expanding & are not suitable for big game. Varmint hunting is the only type of hunting I’d use Mil-Surp ammo for & only in certain circumstances.

Commercial ammo isn’t usually a good choice. The vast majority of commercial loads generate too much gas port pressure to be safely used in a Garand. There are two exceptions: Federal Gold Match & Black Hills Gold. These are accurate rounds suitable for competition shooting. Or at least that’s what I’ve heard. The main drawback is both sell for over $20 per box of 20 cartridges.

So unless you are willing to pay over $1 per shot avoid commercial ammo.

Handloading offers the best of both worlds: it’s almost (but not quite) as inexpensive as Mil-Surp ammo & if loaded correctly it can give you quality that equals or surpasses the top dollar Commercial ammo. Another benefit is that you can use projectiles suitable for damn near any hunting you might wish to do.

But handloading for a Garand (or any gas operated rifle) is a bit more involved than loading ammo for any other type of firearm. There are a few extra steps & possibly extra tools that you’ll need in order to do things properly.

What I cut doesn't cover it all, there is lots of discussion on pressure and pressure curves and a strict warning to NEVER use a bullet heavier than a 180 gr. but you can get the drift on the issue. People have been killed or seriously hurt by operating rods bending and poping loose from using unsuitable loads.

MJM
 
There is quite a bit less rearward bolt thrust with a relatively straight walled case like the .458 Win Mag, compared to the bottle necked '06. Of course the bolt is a bit weaker after being opened up for the .458, but my gut feel is that with the diminished bolt thrust of the straight walled case, it's probably safe to shoot.

I built a Mini 14 in .458 SOCOM as well as several AK's, and M1 Carbines in 502 Thunder Sabre and 10mm Magnum, for what that's worth.......they all worked fine.

Tony Rumore
Tromix Corp
www.tromix.com
 
Interesting, but the Garand has an entirely different gas operating system from what you find on any of those rifles. Aren't they more like the system found on an M14? Also is the trouble with the Garand system NOT a bolt problem, but a gas operating problem since this isn't a blowback design?
 
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