Different results - heres why

Originally Posted By: Smokin250Thanks for info.

I am guessing that your gun light is a red led as well?
No my gun light is white. I don't turn it on until I'm ready to pull the trigger. At that point he's commited and now blinded by the burst of light. Think "deer in the headlights". Everywhere he looks, it's dark, except where he is standing. It gives me that extra second.....

I use the light to comfirm what I'm looking at only. Since he's so close, I need to know now with no error. By the movement I can tell it's a canine...but... is it a coyote or somebodys Lab?
 
We’ll, I’ll get the ball rolling back on daylight calling in hopes to keep this very interesting thread alive…

I know Sled said he only stays for about 10 minutes (except on 1st morning stands) and that seems to work for him. However, it has been my experience that one should absolutely stay 15-20 minutes when calling in around thick. Maybe even 25-30 minutes. Possibly; I get that from the way I call…

I don't follow a certain sequence or sound but I most always start with some type rabbit cry. Sometimes with hand calls then switch to the FP, sometimes just the FP (I still always have handcalls with me). I let it wail for 20-30 seconds, then silence for about the same. Then maybe 10-15 seconds with ~45 seconds of silence. Then maybe a minute of cries, followed by ~40 seconds of silence. Two minutes constant cries, 2-3 minutes of silence.

Then I switch to some type canine distress or puppy whines (I save Ki-Ya for after the shot). Lately, it has been FP’s “scream’n grey”. This is a great sound by the way. I’ve only been using the sound for about a month & I’ve called in (that I seen) 4 grey fox, 6 coyotes & a bobcat (yeah, the cat came to a fox scream). I start this sound with just a few bawls. Maybe 5-8 seconds, followed with a minute of silence. Then a few more short burst back & forth in the next minute. Then follow a similar sequence to the rabbit, until I end up playing solid for 2-3 minutes; usually about 15 minutes or so into the stand.

I do check the time I start a stand but never look back to my watch until I feel like the stand is over. My times vary right much depending on the stand but usually end the set 15-20 minutes & try to stay 5 minutes after the last sound. Sometimes silence is the best call!

I’d say most of my coyotes show up around the 7-10 minute mark in the set (when I am into my second sound). I have very few hard chargers & kill few coyotes or fox with rabbit sounds, but feel they help my set tremendously.
 
I agree completely with using the Scream-N-Gray #226. It has been one of FoxPro's more successful sounds as of recently.

Mike Dillon(FoxPro) and Andrew Lewand did a hunt together and they only used three sounds. Scream-N-Gray was one of them. Andrew wrote an article for one of the predator magazines, I don't remember which one. Defining how Mike told him to use the three sounds. Basically, if one of those three don't prompt results, it is because there ain't nobody home, given that you have set up properly.
 
Scream-N-Grey!!!Amen Brother!!!Mike and Steve Dillon owners of FoxPro both know how I feel about this wonderful sound,its the best!!! CoalRidge I told you that Sonny and I wouldnt tell you wrong friend on these sounds...That was a good read Coalridge.....Chad
 
When I have a good set up, most sounds work great ..... Got a nice female last year on an Antelope distress. They haven't seen or heard an antelope in Massachusetts ...... preds will be preds.

Hard to trash a good stand with bad calling, and impossible to make a bad stand work with "world class" callin'.

We all have our favorites sounds though
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Originally Posted By: Pruson Basically, if one of those three don't prompt results, it is because there ain't nobody home, given that you have set up properly.

sled, you must have noticed that last 1/3 of the last sentence in my post.

On that note, years ago Cooper Woods and I made a great setup one night here in Virginia. Wind was perfect(crosswind), they had a good travel route to come to the call with cover, a nice and secure feeling for them as they came in. We used the most obnoxious sound on that old FoxPro 16, they don't even sell it anymore I don't think. It was the Aggressive Jackrabbit, deep toned bawl, more like a Mule deer than a rabbit. BUT, he came and he died. That is the stand I thought of when you said, "it's hard to mess up a good setup with bad calling"
 
Coleridge, my stands are done in the same fashion.usually I incorporate equal amount of watching/listening as actual calling.Although when I call an area more open than I would like I call more constant.I maybe adding to much human logic into the calling ,but I figure a call going continuos would be more likely to bring them quickly out of their comfort zone.I also end almost every set with the ki-yi.

The 7-10 min mark seems to be my best also.after that I expect any coyote that responds to be using stealth.the runners come within 5 min , usually paired up.

one of the calls that Lewand mentions to use with the screaming grey is DSG cottontail.and I beleive baby cottontail.

seems like I need to download the screaming grey.
 
I don't dispute or agree with anyone elses results while calling, since each setup is individually unique. I've had coyotes come in almost immediately on a setup and I've also waited 30-45 minutes, sometimes longer, for a taker. Therefore, I don't have a set time to quit on a setup. I just go by feel and by how that birds and other animals are responding. Is this correct for everyone? Nope, but it works for me. YMMV MI VHNTR
 
Originally Posted By: 4949shooterThere is a great video posted here by soreloser, which gives a good example of what happens when a coyote hits your scent trail.

http://www.predatormastersforums.com/for...963#Post1342963



Guys often ask about using an e-caller and decoy. One thing I always tell them - kill the coyote BEFORE it gets to the decoy/caller! I've seen this happen way too many times when I first began using an e-caller and decoy set-up a lot. Coyotes will get there and then smell you at the spot you laid the caller/decoy down and bug out super quick. You can see it in their body language. I've watched them come hard on the run, just flat out aggressive hard chargers, eyes locked on the decoy, ears forward, mouth open to bite, front end drops for the bite – and then the ears slam back, the front end comes up and the rear drops as they spin and turn on the afterburners. I lost the biggest coyote I have ever seen waiting for the perfect shot. I later called this coyote King Kong Coyote as he was just simply a massive animal. I had the caller set up to my left about 30 yards away and was up on a ridge top intersection. I saw this big coyote loping hard on the run from my right to my left to the caller/decoy. He ran 25 yards in front of me and I had him right then dead to rights in the scope of my .243 BAR. This coyote was so locked on he never knew I was anywhere around. I tracked him through the scope as he ran by thinking that he would pause for a second or two at the decoy and give me a better shot. No way, he hit my scent at the caller and displayed the body language I described above and ran at an extremely hard angle behind me on the left side away and off the ridge. I never even got on the trigger. A couple of days later the same scenario happened a few miles away with another coyote. It will happen every time unless you take that shot before the coyote gets to the caller/decoy.
 
If you have a decoy that he has already spotted, this is no help, but if you are just using a e-caller and he is coming hard like that, MUTE IT. It will slow things down a bit for the shot. When I hunted with Byron, he was so frustrated with me cause I waited and waited as the caller played continous and I never got that slowed down version for the shot. We discussed it extensively, then in his next "Coming to the Call" DVD he gave me credit for teaching him to hit the mute button and make em slow down and look for it. We had lot of laughs over that. Everybody learns, everytime they go out, I know I do. Byron is a great guy to hunt with, that's for certain. But trust me, we were equally frustrated.

Swampwalker, you're right. That was the three sounds he mentioned in his article, and I think that was the order he said to play them in. That's the same articel I was in reference to.
 
GC ,I've read a few of your posts where you have stated that you favor hunting a cross wind. whats the advantage in this set up.I understand the e-caller and sitter in relation to the wind. For some reason this is a tough concept for me to fully grasp.
 
Originally Posted By: GC
A couple of days later the same scenario happened a few miles away with another coyote. It will happen every time unless you take that shot before the coyote gets to the caller/decoy.

Did you ever see that big dog again?
 
Originally Posted By: PrusonIf you have a decoy that he has already spotted, this is no help, but if you are just using a e-caller and he is coming hard like that, MUTE IT. It will slow things down a bit for the shot. When I hunted with Byron, he was so frustrated with me cause I waited and waited as the caller played continous and I never got that slowed down version for the shot. We discussed it extensively, then in his next "Coming to the Call" DVD he gave me credit for teaching him to hit the mute button and make em slow down and look for it. We had lot of laughs over that. Everybody learns, everytime they go out, I know I do. Byron is a great guy to hunt with, that's for certain. But trust me, we were equally frustrated.

Swampwalker, you're right. That was the three sounds he mentioned in his article, and I think that was the order he said to play them in. That's the same articel I was in reference to.

Yea Sonny,I watched you on Coming to the Call part 2 last night and I heard Byron say that was a trick Sonny Pruitt taught me about turning the call down....By the way,that was a good running shot you put on that coyote Sonny!
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LOL! Yea, I had to learn quick to shoot em on the run. Byron wouldn't give me any other opportunities. They came in HOT! and left HOTTER, tucked, turned and turbo's kicked in.

I had an unbelievably good time with Byron. It was like we had hunted together all our lives. We harrassed each other, picked on each other, but never quit laughing. That has been at least five or six years ago now. I had to borrow his AR to start killing coyotes.
 
Im practicing my running shots right now for when I go down to hunt with Byron this fall...I probably should take an AR or a shotgun so I will have something to throw alot of lead with
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...

By the Way: HAPPY BIRTHDAY SLEDDOG!
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Originally Posted By: sleddoggWhen I have a good set up, most sounds work great ..... Got a nice female last year on an Antelope distress. They haven't seen or heard an antelope in Massachusetts ...... preds will be preds.

Hard to trash a good stand with bad calling, and impossible to make a bad stand work with "world class" callin'.

We all have our favorites sounds though
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I absolutely believe that! The sounds we use are one of the least important factors in a set. However, I believe certain sounds trigger a certain response. Prey sounds, be-it birds/rabbits/deer/chicken/woods-twinky cause them to respond in hunger or just plain curiosity. The hurt coyote/pup/fox sounds triggers a more primal response. Have you ever seen a group of house dogs that pal around buddy-buddy with each other? Just let one get hit by a car or get bad hurt somehow & start bawling. Each other dog in that group will jump on the hurt dog & do their best to kill it. It's just canine nature...???


Pruson... I just resently watch Byron's vol II as well. I didn't make that connection that it was you. I could tell from the video that ya'll were having a good time!
 
Coleridge, he didn't show all the misses on running shots, where he dogged me unmercifully,LOL

About those dogs that are buddy-buddy that you mentioned. On one of the farms where I groundhog hunt, there are two yellow labs. Beautiful dogs. They've learned to hark to the gunshot when I shoot a groundhog. They drag off the dead hog and devour it together. Well, recently I shot one at about 250 yds or so with the 17 Ackley Hornet. It was not a fatal shot, but it immobilized the hog. The dogs got there and grabbed the groundhog while it was still alive. They went to fighting over it and the big male decided he would let the little female have the groundhog. As he is trotting away at about 50-60 yds. The little female lab goes to screaming bloody murder. I turn and see the groundhog with his teeth sunk into her face(the lab's), she is screaming and backing up and shaking her head trying to dislodge the pig. It hurts me just looking at it. In a nano of a flash second that male lab was back to her aid, grabbed the groundhog and I heard the bones crunch 25 yards away. They respond out of loyalty as well. He then just turned, once the pig was done for, and simply walked away casually. The female bolted out of there towards the house, looking at me like it was all my fault, and I guess it was. Poor thing.
 
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