Slow twist 22 creedmoor, who’s done it?

Duhhh

Duhhh

Well-known member
Does anyone on here have a 1:12 or 1:14 twist 22 creedmoor or 22-250 AI? saami specd reamer preferred.

I’m going to rebarrel my 22-250 this summer and was originally planning on a 22 inch 1:8 twist barrel.

Kinda having second thoughts now and thinking about trying to push a 53 grain vmax around 3800-4K fps range for my thermal gun. Was thinking an 22 inch 1:14 twist barrel. I think I can get close with Varget or superformance powder and Alpha OCD brass. Obviously I’m backing myself into a corner with only being able to shoot light bullets.

I’m not sure if I’m overthinking this but I’ve read some reports about 22 creeds or the creedmors in general not having the best extreme spreads and standard deviations with the lighter bullets because of case fill. I’m sure 500 yards and in it really shouldn’t matter but I’m just curious on some of your thoughts.
 
Those 53gr Vmax are a fairly long for weight bullet with a rather short bearing surface so you'll want at least a 12tw or faster barrel to shoot them. Another to consider if you want to shoot light and fast bullets would be the new 62gr ELD-VT but you'll want somewhere around an 8tw for those as they are a very long for weight bullet.

Ballistically speaking the 22 CM and 22-250AI are virtually twinsies but to save yourself the extra effort, personally, I'd skip right past the Ack Imp and jump all over the 22 Creed.

In all honesty since you already have one and you're already setup for a 22-250 I wouldn't bother with either one of the others and I'd rebarrel your rifle right back to a straight 22-250 with whatever twist is best for the bullet/s you plan to shoot.

One of my "go to" coyote rifles is a suppressed 22-250 with a 18in 12tw Brux barrel shooting those 53gr Vmax. If I miss a coyote inside of 500yds with it chances are extremely high I would have equally missed it with a 22-250AI or 22 Creed.
 
Ok good to know on the 1:14s not being optimal with the 53 vmax. Either way I go, I’m chasing speed because this will be a dedicated thermal gun.

So the original plan was to shoot the 62 vts in a 1:8 24inch creedmoor. Hearing mixed reports on the 62s but the 73-75 eldms can be a good fall back.

Now this may sound snobby but I’m pretty turned off to the 22-250 now because I can’t get Lapua brass for it anymore. I’m currently shooting up my supply of it now.

The 22 creed has better brass availability and looks like it’s here to stay. I already have everything to load for the 22 creed too.
 
Yeah definitely a 12 for the 53's. The 62's would be sweet, IF they shoot and IF they don't splash at those speeds, which from what I'm hearing is two big ifs. My buddy went with the 69 tmk's and has done really well this past year with his 22 C with them. I too believe the Creeds are here to stay and are a better mouse trap than the "legacy" rounds, even though I'm pretty well married to the 243 for the foreseeable future. If I wasn't, it would be 6 or 22 C.

I'll just add that with today's thermals with built in bdc reticals, being stupid flat isn't all that important anymore to me.
 
Duhhh said:
I’m chasing speed because this will be a dedicated thermal gun.

I’m pretty turned off to the 22-250 now because I can’t get Lapua brass for it anymore. I’m currently shooting up my supply of it now.

The 22 creed has better brass availability and looks like it’s here to stay. I already have everything to load for the 22 creed too.
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Taking the above into consideration the obvious choice would be a 22 Creed then. Wouldn't make much sense to go with the improved version of a 22-250 if you can't get good quality brass, like Lapua, for the standard version.

I believe "skinney" has been shooting coyotes with those 62gr ELD-VT's since they first came out. You can check with him to confirm but I think he's been pretty happy with how they're putting coyotes down for him and if I recall he's shooting them from a 22-250.

I've always been a big fan of the 22-250 but as you mentioned finding Lapua brass for one currently isn't very easy. If you're setup for both the 250 and Creed as well as you're looking for more velocity the easy button definitely favors the 22CM.

Funny 204 AR mentioned a 6 Creedmoor because of my two "go to" coyote guns a 6 Creed is the other one. I'd still like to do a 22 ARC or 22 Nosler AR setup though.
 
204 AR said:
I'll just add that with today's thermals with built in bdc reticals, being stupid flat isn't all that important anymore to me.
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That’s the other choice I’m going to make this off season. I’m likely going away from my AGM V2 varmint at some point. Just can’t decide between the Nocpix H50R, Rix DBH, or the more outdated Nvision XRF. Gonna watch this trade war and potential “investigation” into the Chinese thermal companies.

If I do stick with my AGM for another season, that 3800-4k fps will be a cheat code for me. Just gotta play the wind a little with those light bullets.

B23 said:
6 Creedmoor because of my two "go to" coyote guns a 6 Creed is the other one
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My 6 creed with the 80 eldvt is definitely my go to for day time.
 
Just form 22-250 brass from a different cartridge. I form it from 6.5 creedmoor or 243. It’s a little work but worth it if you like what you shoot.
 
I've worn out two 12 twist .22-250AI barrels. While a few dozen coyote did get killed with them, they were rock chuck barrels. Shot 55 Vmax for the life of both of them. Both Lilja, crowned at 27". First one got 3950 with the 55's and long primer pocket life. Second, could only scrape 3800 out of and that was with N550, which is a barrel scorching powder - and that barrel did indeed die sooner.

I've got a new Brux 12 twist being chambered in .22 Dasher, with a tight neck and zero freebore, for the 53 Vmax, going to be crowned at 28". Starting to seem like I might be waiting forever for it though. Sent it to LRI and they have been impossible to get ahold of on the phone and only occasionally give one sentence replies to emails. So, at this point I have literally zero idea of when it will be done but I'm going with it will be "forever". I regret choosing LRI this time and it will be the last time...

But this will be a dedicated 'chuck rifle. Don't care what it might do for coyote. Just chasing the need for speed with the 53 Vmax. I have more than enough Lapua BR cases on the shelf to wear out the barrel. More than enough Lapua .22-250 to wear out a barrel too, for that matter. But I need to get some of that Alpha brass to try for the Dasher too. Hoping, not expecting, but hoping for a legit 4,000 fps - without killing primer pockets prematurely.

- DAA
 
DAA said:
I've worn out two 12 twist .22-250AI barrels. While a few dozen coyote did get killed with them, they were rock chuck barrels. Shot 55 Vmax for the life of both of them. Both Lilja, crowned at 27". First one got 3950 with the 55's and long primer pocket life. Second, could only scrape 3800 out of and that was with N550, which is a barrel scorching powder - and that barrel did indeed die sooner.

I've got a new Brux 12 twist being chambered in .22 Dasher, with a tight neck and zero freebore, for the 53 Vmax, going to be crowned at 28". Starting to seem like I might be waiting forever for it though. Sent it to LRI and they have been impossible to get ahold of on the phone and only occasionally give one sentence replies to emails. So, at this point I have literally zero idea of when it will be done but I'm going with it will be "forever". I regret choosing LRI this time and it will be the last time...

But this will be a dedicated 'chuck rifle. Don't care what it might do for coyote. Just chasing the need for speed with the 53 Vmax. I have more than enough Lapua BR cases on the shelf to wear out the barrel. More than enough Lapua .22-250 to wear out a barrel too, for that matter. But I need to get some of that Alpha brass to try for the Dasher too. Hoping, not expecting, but hoping for a legit 4,000 fps - without killing primer pockets prematurely.

- DAA
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Good to know! So the do you recall if the vmax performed well on the coyotes you shot at those 3800-3950 speeds?

That probably should have been my real question to start this thread. I’d hate to build a laser beam for a gun and have the intended bullet not hold up well. I just haven’t heard or seen to many guys talking about shooting the 50-55 grainers at or close to that 4K speed.

I saw a YouTube video a bit ago where a guy was talking about another wildcat called the 22 parvo (basically a necked down 6.5x47). Supposedly it addresses the possible case fill issue with the Creedmoor and lite bullets. From my understanding, it’s supposed to result in lower ES.

Im probably over thinking it and trying to address a problem that’s non existent or minimal. But I’m about to order a new barrel and get away from my slow tikka barrel.
 
Duhhh said:
So the do you recall if the vmax performed well on the coyotes you shot at those 3800-3950 speeds?
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Tended to be messy, but, sufficiently authoritative. Killed them just fine. Grain for grain, I've always found the B-tip better for coyote though. But the Vmax give better air time on 'chucks for sure. And I like to see how high I can launch them.

- DAA
 
I have a 22-250AI 12 twist and shoot 53 vmax @ 3900+. The AI cartridge doesn't feed well. I made brass from 6.5 creedmoor, and yes it was a PITA but I didn't want to use what I had left of my 22-250. I would go with a 22 CM if I were to do it again and use small rifle primer brass but I would stay with a 12 twist because lite bullets may come apart in my can @ the speeds the CM will push them with a faster twist
 
why said:
I have a 22-250AI 12 twist and shoot 53 vmax @ 3900+. The AI cartridge doesn't feed well. I made brass from 6.5 creedmoor, and yes it was a PITA but I didn't want to use what I had left of my 22-250. I would go with a 22 CM if I were to do it again and use small rifle primer brass but I would stay with a 12 twist because lite bullets may come apart in my can @ the speeds the CM will push them with a faster twist
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Do you like the performance of the 53 vmax at that speed? What’s your barrel length?

The fastest I’ve been able to get my 22-250 with the 53 vmax has been 3500. It’s been great for me at that speed but a little less drop would be perfect.
 
My barrel is 25" which is 1 reason I don't carry it often. With a can it's more like 32". I zero @ 250 and feel good out to around 325 or so without dialing or holding over. Pretty much all I have killed with it are fox and groundhogs and bullet performance is the same as a straight 250. I had a baffle strike with a 50 vmax in a 7 twist so I stay away from fast twist lite bullet combo. You should be able to get more speed from your 22-250, I get 3550 out of a 223AI with the 53's and a 24" barrel.
 
I ran a 26" 12 twist 22-250 for years with the 53 v-max in the low 3900's with H4895. It was instant death on coyotes.
I rebarreled to a 24" 9 twist, and can still break 3900fps no problem with Leverevolution. I know Tikka barrels have a reputation for being slow, but maybe a different powder would yield better results.
A 22" 22 Creed should be able to do 3900 pretty easy with the right powder. Maybe Superformance, Lever, or CFE223.
 
Yeah I’ve used Varget and superformance the most. Just a little too slow but I can stack a 10 shot group like no other.

I appreciate the info you guys have provided. I think im going to order a 12 twist and have a laser beam for a thermal rig.
 
If you don't already have some I'd pick up some RL17. You'll find 17 is a top performer with the mid weight bullets like the 53 Vmax in 22-250/22CM size cases. Both, IMR and Hodg 4895 are great "go to" powders for those two cartridges using mid 50's bullets but won't be quite as speedy as RL17. IMR4895 typically produces slightly faster velocity then its brother from another mother H4895. I'd start with RL17 and you'll likely find everything you're looking for in velocity and accuracy too. I use it with 53 Vmax in my 22-250 and been pretty happy with it.
 
Theres 2 guys I follow closely on Instagram that have been running 22 creeds with 12 twist and 53 vmax and the results seem to be downright spectacular. Zane buchanan is building them I believe and he has been regularly showing real time group shooting at distance that is extremely impressive.
 
Yotarunner said:
Theres 2 guys I follow closely on Instagram that have been running 22 creeds with 12 twist and 53 vmax and the results seem to be downright spectacular. Zane buchanan is building them I believe and he has been regularly showing real time group shooting at distance that is extremely impressive.
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I just found him and Mitch on the interwebs recently. That’s what really got the wheels rolling on that slow twist 22CM. Going to order my barrel real soon.
 


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