A rare sight for me.

[medic joe]

I've read over the many yrs. Various biologists & long time hunters opinions/findings. Of Coyote & Red Fox behaviors. Some opinions of which I believed were true. Some I disagreed with, oh well. The topic of which. Was when an alpha male would keep a female yearling. In order to breed with her the following Spring. Not many years later. I witnessed that 2x with the coyotes. And 2x with the Red Fox.

Below is an alpha pair. With 1 off spring in tow. That day if I recall was in late February. The yearling is in the fore ground(submissive posturing). The alpha male on the left & his female mate on the right. When either adult approached that yearling. It would not move, but always lowered it's head in submission. Also her tail would be slightly tucked between her hind legs or off to her flanking side.

 

[Spurchaser]

Newer studies show that not all coyotes leave or disperse. Mostly it’s the males that leave and most of the females stick around. Believe this study was based off radio collared coyotes.
I think Tall Timbers should be releasing a study in February about range and dispersal.

 

[medic joe]

Newer studies show that not all coyotes leave or disperse. Mostly it’s the males that leave and most of the females stick around. Believe this study was based off radio collared coyotes.
I think Tall Timbers should be releasing a study in February about range and dispersal.

I find the whole topic interesting. I've seen a few thousand + coyotes in my time & as for the Red Fox probably 350-400 I'm guessing off hand. As I mentioned above. I've never seen either alpha pair(coyotes or Red Fox). With a female yearling in tow. Except for what I have mentioned above. Maybe that behavior varies region to region. I can't say.

 

[hm1996]

Below is an alpha pair. With 1 off spring in tow. That day if I recall was in late February. The yearling is in the fore ground(submissive posturing). The alpha male on the left & his female mate on the right. When either adult approached that yearling. It would not move, but always lowered it's head in submission. Also her tail would be slightly tucked between her hind legs or off to her flanking side.

Dave (DAA) posted a fantastic video a while back showing this behavior (drone footage starts at about 5 minute mark.

Newer studies show that not all coyotes leave or disperse. Mostly it’s the males that leave and most of the females stick around. Believe this study was based off radio collared coyotes.

Over the years I've seen groups of three that appear to be the pair and a YOY and wondered if the odd one was a young female.

 

[DAA]

Common as dirt in my area.

- DAA

 

[BrianID]

Interesting topic. I've killed young females that were with a big male. I've wondered if she was his mate or from his litter the year before. There are a lot of things we don't know about coyotes. Everything I've read and seen makes me think they generally have one mating pair but wouldn't be shocked to find out there are instances of a dominant male breading more than one female in a year.

 

[DAA]

I think the majority of these we see are what a lot of people call "betas". They aren't breeding. They are just allowed to hang around and have been observed helping to feed/care for the next years litter.

Never say never and coyotes are just going to do what they do but an alpha, breeding female, would not be too likely to tolerate another bred female in the same den. If you ever watch these trios interact, the old lady will not put up with any guff from the beta. Look at the posture of this beta.

You think Momma is going to let her stick around if she shows signs of wanting to be bred? Yeah, no... I can't remember which thread it was but I posted a video of a mated pair and a beta on the hunt not too long ago. Same deal, you can see the old one isn't going to stand for the beta claiming any status whatsoever.

This is a beta and an adult female bedded down together. Note, since a recent popular topic is where do coyotes bed during the day - they are bedded at the edge of an open flat and not on the hill directly behind them.

The old one hollering for her old man.

He showed up soon after and the three of them headed out on patrol.

But seeing a mated pair and a single female last years pup together is pretty common in my experience.

And in my area, coyotes just bed wherever they feel like it for whatever their reasons are. A popular bedding spot is out in the middle of a playa. A playa surrounded with thick cover. Instead of bedding on any of the many hills nearby, or in the cover, they choose to bed on the playa. Very common around here.

Coyote just does what coyote thinks it needs to do. Or wants to do. And what might seem unusual in one area might seem very common to someone in another. Or, often as not, seem very common to someone else in the same area.

Most academic studies of coyote have serious flaws. They are all interesting. But none of them should be taken too seriously. The best example might be Crabtree's work in Yellowstone. He studied completely unexploited coyotes and made a lot of fascinating observations and formed a lot of fascinating theories. But almost none of those theories hold up in the real world of harassed, hunted, trapped, exploited coyotes. Never the less, those theories have been enshrined and promulgated and embellished and built upon for decades. It's all interesting. But most of it has zero application to hunting exploited coyotes.

- DAA

 

[hm1996]

Dave (DAA) posted a fantastic video a while back showing this behavior (drone footage starts at about 5 minute mark.

I can't remember which thread it was but I posted a video of a mated pair and a beta on the hunt not too long ago. Same deal, you can see the old one isn't going to stand for the beta claiming any status whatsoever.

Yeah, I intended to post that video in above post. Ooops!

Dave (DAA) posted a fantastic video a while back showing this behavior (drone footage starts at about 5 minute mark.

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="" title="Coyote Hunting Nov. &#39;22 in 4K!" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" referrerpolicy="strict-origin-when-cross-origin" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[hm1996]

And in my area, coyotes just bed wherever they feel like it for whatever their reasons are. A popular bedding spot is out in the middle of a playa. A playa surrounded with thick cover. Instead of bedding on any of the many hills nearby, or in the cover, they choose to bed on the playa. Very common around here.

Coyote just does what coyote thinks it needs to do. Or wants to do. And what might seem unusual in one area might seem very common to someone in another. Or, often as not, seem very common to someone else in the same area.

Question, Dave. I know you can't say never or always, but do you find it difficult to call a bedded coyote? Reason I ask, I cannot remember ever seeing a coyote bedded down here due to the thick brush or grass everywhere except lake beds (in dry years), roads and mowed areas.

 

[medic joe]

I think the majority of these we see are what a lot of people call "betas". They aren't breeding. They are just allowed to hang around and have been observed helping to feed/care for the next years litter.

Never say never and coyotes are just going to do what they do but an alpha, breeding female, would not be too likely to tolerate another bred female in the same den. If you ever watch these trios interact, the old lady will not put up with any guff from the beta. Look at the posture of this beta.

You think Momma is going to let her stick around if she shows signs of wanting to be bred? Yeah, no... I can't remember which thread it was but I posted a video of a mated pair and a beta on the hunt not too long ago. Same deal, you can see the old one isn't going to stand for the beta claiming any status whatsoever.

This is a beta and an adult female bedded down together. Note, since a recent popular topic is where do coyotes bed during the day - they are bedded at the edge of an open flat and not on the hill directly behind them.

The old one hollering for her old man.

He showed up soon after and the three of them headed out on patrol.

But seeing a mated pair and a single female last years pup together is pretty common in my experience.

And in my area, coyotes just bed wherever they feel like it for whatever their reasons are. A popular bedding spot is out in the middle of a playa. A playa surrounded with thick cover. Instead of bedding on any of the many hills nearby, or in the cover, they choose to bed on the playa. Very common around here.

Coyote just does what coyote thinks it needs to do. Or wants to do. And what might seem unusual in one area might seem very common to someone in another. Or, often as not, seem very common to someone else in the same area.

Most academic studies of coyote have serious flaws. They are all interesting. But none of them should be taken too seriously. The best example might be Crabtree's work in Yellowstone. He studied completely unexploited coyotes and made a lot of fascinating observations and formed a lot of fascinating theories. But almost none of those theories hold up in the real world of harassed, hunted, trapped, exploited coyotes. Never the less, those theories have been enshrined and promulgated and embellished and built upon for decades. It's all interesting. But most of it has zero application to hunting exploited coyotes.

- DAA

They bed in flat areas I've hunted also. My opinion/observations are. If they do bed on flat land. They will have the wind at their backside 99.9% of the time. Also if they bed on a hill side. They will be found on the down wind slope of that hill or ridgeline. I've read many years ago. A couple of people claiming. When the alpha pair. Keep a female yearling back. It is to help nurse the alpha female's cubs. That I do not believe. I also do not believe trespassing is rampant or common place year around. Other than prior to & or during mating season. When many yearlings have been scattered/dispersed by their parents.

 

[DAA]

Question, Dave. I know you can't say never or always, but do you find it difficult to call a bedded coyote? Reason I ask, I cannot remember ever seeing a coyote bedded down here due to the thick brush or grass everywhere except lake beds (in dry years), roads and mowed areas.

My limited experience, no, I don't think a bedded coyote is any more difficult to call than a non-bedded daytime coyote. In my area. During the fall and winter. I think a fair percentage of the coyotes I call during the day get up from their beds to come to the call. I know for a fact because I have watched it happen that I have "woken up" a few coyotes that came straight to the call upon arising.

- DAA

 

[DAA]

It is to help nurse the alpha female's cubs. That I do not believe. I also do not believe trespassing is rampant or common place year around.

None of the guys I know that do a lot of denning work would agree with you on the beta female. Dens with multiple litters aren't common, but not totally rare, but they also aren't from mothers and daughters in the same den very often at all. That would be pretty bizarre. Indeed it's the multiple litter dens that gave rise to the compensatory natality theories which a lot of experienced ADC denners thinks is all a bunch of hooey.

I don't believe many coyotes defend a territory year round. I don't believe most coyotes are, or are ever going to be territorial. But of the ones who are territorial, I don't see why they would expend the energy trying to defend a territory most of the year. There's a difference between having a home range and being territorial. I think the home range of most coyotes overlaps the "territory" of mated pairs. I think those coyotes move across other coyotes "territory" routinely. I believe it's not unusual for scenarios that cause all territorial behaviors to break down completely. If the food is abundant enough, there will be more coyotes taking advantage of it than any pair could hope to defend against and I don't believe this is uncommon.

For my area, I think this whole notion of territory is way over thought and over blown. How many alpha pairs even both get to stay alive in any given year? In my area a whole lot of them don't. What then?

- DAA

 

[DAA]

A couple of people claiming. When the alpha pair. Keep a female yearling back. It is to help nurse the alpha female's cubs. That I do not believe.

And I can't help but be curious. Since you say this is a rare sighting for you, what makes you disbelieve the many people for whom it's a common experience? Especially ADC guys that do denning work? I see mated pairs with one pup together often, and I don't think that pup is going to be getting bred. But that's based on a lot of actual seeing. Since you never see it, what makes you think that pup is going to get bred?

- DAA

 

[medic joe]

And I can't help but be curious. Since you say this is a rare sighting for you, what makes you disbelieve the many people for whom it's a common experience? Especially ADC guys that do denning work? I see mated pairs with one pup together often, and I don't think that pup is going to be getting bred. But that's based on a lot of actual seeing. Since you never see it, what makes you think that pup is going to get bred?

- DAA

None of the guys I know that do a lot of denning work would agree with you on the beta female. Dens with multiple litters aren't common, but not totally rare, but they also aren't from mothers and daughters in the same den very often at all. That would be pretty bizarre. Indeed it's the multiple litter dens that gave rise to the compensatory natality theories which a lot of experienced ADC denners thinks is all a bunch of hooey.

I don't believe many coyotes defend a territory year round. I don't believe most coyotes are, or are ever going to be territorial. But of the ones who are territorial, I don't see why they would expend the energy trying to defend a territory most of the year. There's a difference between having a home range and being territorial. I think the home range of most coyotes overlaps the "territory" of mated pairs. I think those coyotes move across other coyotes "territory" routinely. I believe it's not unusual for scenarios that cause all territorial behaviors to break down completely. If the food is abundant enough, there will be more coyotes taking advantage of it than any pair could hope to defend against and I don't believe this is uncommon.

For my area, I think this whole notion of territory is way over thought and over blown. How many alpha pairs even both get to stay alive in any given year? In my area a whole lot of them don't. What then?

- DAA

I have seen a few instances. Where territorial pair of coyotes. Seen a trespasser from a distance. Both times the trespasser seen them standing on a hill over looking a wide valley, looking their way. Where the "trespasser" was bedded down. Both times the trespasser seen the pair & quickly got up. Heading the opposite direction. Another instance about territory. I came in contact with a farmer who was having his sheep slaughtered. So I told that farmer I would hunt his area hard all Winter. So I hunted his ground & neighboring land. Looking for the pair. The sheep farmer told me he often seen them on his 1x2 mile section. He also told me one of them was large. Near the end of that 1st Winter. I seen a large coyote laying along a fence line drift 1/2 mile from the road. Once I went prone on the last hill top. I noticed an average size coyote. Bedded down the hill from where he was. I missed the large one & killed the female. That farmers sheep killing came to a halt. Yet I continued hunting the area. I wanted the large coyote. He left a firm paw print 3" long. As I continued to circle that land section. NO other coyote came in or out of that 1x2 mile. But only his lone track came in & out. YET there were other neighboring coyotes. So why didn't even 1 of them travel into that 1x2 mile. I figured that was because that was his marked territory. Do I know for a fact an alpha male coyote. Will keep a female yearling for breeding purposes. No, I don't. However, I knew of one old female Red fox. Who denned in a culvert tube. Year after year. Right at 1/2 mile away in opposite directions from her den site. Were 2 other red Fox dens, they were Earthen dens. The old female had 5 kits every year. The 2 other active dens only had 2 kits, for only one year. Then those dens were abandoned. Those two other dens with only 2 kits. I believe the male to the old female. Bred two of his female off spring. The reason why I believe that is. The old male was the only male seen. No other males were seen at the two other den sites. I believe those females raised their kits alone.

 

[medic joe]

And I can't help but be curious. Since you say this is a rare sighting for you, what makes you disbelieve the many people for whom it's a common experience? Especially ADC guys that do denning work? I see mated pairs with one pup together often, and I don't think that pup is going to be getting bred. But that's based on a lot of actual seeing. Since you never see it, what makes you think that pup is going to get bred?

- DAA

I say it is rare. Because from all of the many hundreds of pairs. Of coyotes I've observed. I only seen 2 pairs that I can recall. That had a yearling in tow.

 

[medic joe]

I think the majority of these we see are what a lot of people call "betas". They aren't breeding. They are just allowed to hang around and have been observed helping to feed/care for the next years litter.

Never say never and coyotes are just going to do what they do but an alpha, breeding female, would not be too likely to tolerate another bred female in the same den. If you ever watch these trios interact, the old lady will not put up with any guff from the beta. Look at the posture of this beta.

You think Momma is going to let her stick around if she shows signs of wanting to be bred? Yeah, no... I can't remember which thread it was but I posted a video of a mated pair and a beta on the hunt not too long ago. Same deal, you can see the old one isn't going to stand for the beta claiming any status whatsoever.

This is a beta and an adult female bedded down together. Note, since a recent popular topic is where do coyotes bed during the day - they are bedded at the edge of an open flat and not on the hill directly behind them.

The old one hollering for her old man.

He showed up soon after and the three of them headed out on patrol.

But seeing a mated pair and a single female last years pup together is pretty common in my experience.

And in my area, coyotes just bed wherever they feel like it for whatever their reasons are. A popular bedding spot is out in the middle of a playa. A playa surrounded with thick cover. Instead of bedding on any of the many hills nearby, or in the cover, they choose to bed on the playa. Very common around here.

Coyote just does what coyote thinks it needs to do. Or wants to do. And what might seem unusual in one area might seem very common to someone in another. Or, often as not, seem very common to someone else in the same area.

Most academic studies of coyote have serious flaws. They are all interesting. But none of them should be taken too seriously. The best example might be Crabtree's work in Yellowstone. He studied completely unexploited coyotes and made a lot of fascinating observations and formed a lot of fascinating theories. But almost none of those theories hold up in the real world of harassed, hunted, trapped, exploited coyotes. Never the less, those theories have been enshrined and promulgated and embellished and built upon for decades. It's all interesting. But most of it has zero application to hunting exploited coyotes.

- DAA

I differ quite a bit at times from other experienced coyote hunters OR people that study coyote behaviors. Often I concur with them. Because I have seen the same. Do I believe all of their claims" No I don't. However, I do not nor have I seen everything they have witnessed. Myself, no doubt I have witnessed behaviors I'm sure they haven't either. Well, then who is factual & who isn't. Somethings I have witnessed coyotes do. Is based on theory from what I have deduced. Take for example, I've seen two (harassed) three legged coyotes. Clear a 5 strand barbed fence as they ran full out up a steep hillside. Those two 3 legged coyotes. Cleared those fences with ease, like a 4 legged dear. Now does that mean ALL 3 legged coyotes can do the same? No it doesn't. For two continual winters. I observed 3 territorial pairs of coyotes. From what I could tell. All 3 of those pairs territories butted up to each other. Out of those 3 pairs of coyotes. One was massive. He no doubt was a coyote hybrid. He was paired up with a little mousy grey coyote. She was about 1/2 his size. That large male left a firm print 4" long. He & his mate. Traveled where ever they wanted to from Fall until Spring, as they both trespassed continually. Many yrs ago I had 1 ADC dog/guy/ trapper . Tell me "coyotes ONLY use den holes. While rearing their young". I thought you are an idiot. Do I believe all "claims/studies" From well know experts". No I don't. When they claim some behavior the opposite of what I've seen. Their claims....Are they all inclusive. Or just an observation(s), from a specific coyote?" IMO any man or woman "expert" can claim with total authority". They know or have seen it all. Well to that I call bullarky. No one has seen it all & no one knows it all.

 

[medic joe]

Interesting topic. I've killed young females that were with a big male. I've wondered if she was his mate or from his litter the year before. There are a lot of things we don't know about coyotes. Everything I've read and seen makes me think they generally have one mating pair but wouldn't be shocked to find out there are instances of a dominant male breading more than one female in a year.

My sentiments exactly. IF...NOT for breeding purposes. Then all that is left imo. Would be that young female was kept by the alpha pair. As a "Baby sitter". Frankly that theory makes little to no sense to me. So if that were true in all cases. Then the alpha female felt she needed help rearing her young? Really? Why is that? Was she inept or had psycho/behavioral anomalies? And knew she was not a fit mother to raise her young ALONE? Unless she had help rearing her young?

 

[medic joe]

I'll comment on a few more aspects of what I believe, doubt or not believe. Regarding any coyote hunter or any person who studies or claims to "know coyotes". For starters, I have seen coyotes bed down out on flat open ground. But when they do 99.9% of the time. They WILL have their backside towards the prevailing wind. As for calling a coyote that is bedded down. I claimed it is hard to get one to respond to a call sound. Because I have tried that myself. Those coyotes were reluctant to respond. Another thing about me, what I have observed. What I have theorized to be true. At times my opinion(s) are or were. Based upon one observation OR many repeated observations. I don't claim to know or have "seen it all". However, I have seen, observed & know enough to get me by. When I post pictures. I often post them to give a visual aid to help explain my opinion. The reasons behind my posts. ARE to help or assist. The younger hunters or NEW hunters. In having a "Base" to learn from. As for ALL other more (experienced hunters). I do not give a rats rump. Whether they mock me or dismiss my opinions. I make posts to educate the young hunter(s). NOT to "claim" I know or have seen it all.

 

[medic joe]

I'll comment on a few more aspects of what I believe, doubt or not believe. Regarding any coyote hunter or any person who studies or claims to "know coyotes". For starters, I have seen coyotes bed down out on flat open ground. But when they do 99.9% of the time. They WILL have their backside towards the prevailing wind. As for calling a coyote that is bedded down. I claimed it is hard to get one to respond to a call sound. Because I have tried that myself. Those coyotes were reluctant to respond. Another thing about me, what I have observed. What I have theorized to be true. At times my opinion(s) are or were. Based upon one observation OR many repeated observations. I don't claim to know or have "seen it all". However, I have seen, observed & know enough to get me by. When I post pictures. I often post them to give a visual aid to help explain my opinion. The reasons behind my posts. ARE to help or assist. The younger hunters or NEW hunters. In having a "Base" to learn from. As for ALL other more (experienced hunters). I do not give a rats rump. Whether they mock me or dismiss my opinions. I make posts to educate the young hunter(s). NOT to "claim" I know or have seen it all.

Another point of discussion. I do believe MOST marked territorial coyotes. Will often travel their marked territory. Daily or in a similar time frame to daily. I would call it, often. Do they do that mainly looking for trespassers? I can't say either way. I'll go with hunting & looking for trespassers during hunting. I believe many if not most coyotes know they are trespassing on another coyote's MARKED land. One visual aspect I've witnessed from a trespassing coyote IS. While bedded down. They act nervous & often pan 360. I suspect being on the look out for the territorial pair. When a territorial coyote(s) are bedded down on his/her own land. They'll at times pan 180. Not continually panning around 360, like a trespasser does. When they do look 360. It is no doubt based upon them hearing or scenting something to their "up wind" direction. While on their own land. They are very observant to sights & sounds. They have heard or scented. Otherwise they remain at ease while they are bedded down.

 

[DAA]

As I continued to circle that land section. NO other coyote came in or out of that 1x2 mile. But only his lone track came in & out. YET there were other neighboring coyotes. So why didn't even 1 of them travel into that 1x2 mile.

A single coyote, kept all other coyotes out of two square miles? Good grief... I can't even think of an appropriate comment on that. So, I think I'll just bow out here. As a last comment, I would caution the newer hunters looking to learn something to carefully separate the pepper from the fly chit.

- DAA